Tell me a little about yourself.

My name is Meiling, age 24 — I'm a year older than most people in my graduating class. At home in Singapore, the school year is between January to December, so I missed the fall entrance date. I had some time off between high school and college.

What are you doing now?

I am working at Google as an Associate Product Marketing Manager.

Is this what you want to do in the long run?

In all honesty, I don't really know what I want to do in the long, long run. I think Google is a great place to work at and I believe in the company's mission and philosophy, but who knows how things will change for me later. The honest answer is "I don't know," but it's a great place to start.

What aspect was it that drew you to what you're doing now?

It's a combination of natural interest in tech and the particular work culture, since I think that's important, but it's also a matter of coincidence, fate, or how life happened. In my first internship, I did a start up and at the time, I didn't know what to do and thought marketing sounded fun. I didn't want to do finance but wanted to stay in business. That marketing job rolled onto a Google internship, which took me to where I am now. I think a few people know what they want to do in the beginning, but that's few and far between. The world doesn't really make people that way.

Definitely agree — I used to know what I wanted, and now I don't, haha. So in picking these kinds of opportunities, what's most important to you?

Hard question. Maybe this is a cop out, but I think it's making the most out of whatever you have. This includes the person I love, my family, as well as making the most out of my current situation, which is being in New York even though I'm originally from Singapore. I want to make the most out of my current position, and be able to dance. For me it's very much about figuring out what else I can do with what I have — "Am I doing everything I can do with what I have?" — while making sure I still value the relationships that are also very important to me.

Would you say that's a very present-oriented way of thinking?

It's a bit of present and future. Yeah, it is about making the most of what I have now but also maximizing what can come. I think I am an idealist and I want every aspect of my life to be great, so all aspects are important as long as I value them. So I want a good relationship, I want friends and family, a good career, and I want to be able to dance. It was easy to do in school, but tougher to do at work.

Seems like all your bases are covered! What's going the best now, and what's the hardest to keep up with?

The easiest is love, which I am fortunate for. Career is also pretty good — other people are in some crazy positions but I'm in a good place. Dancing is up there too — I always say I could be doing more than I am, but I'm in a great city for dance. Friends are harder to keep up with, especially friends from the U.S. For my friends from home, we don't have to talk every day and I know we'll be close. I'll chat with them or WhatsApp them. For my friends from the states, because I was so busy in school, I don't think the foundations were as strong. Now, I still want to have friends but it's harder to build that foundation now that school isn't here.

Are most of your friends close by, or long distance?

My closest friends are still my friends from home, so mostly back in Singapore with some in the UK. I still have good friends in the city, but I can't really compare those relationships. Some people I've just known for longer.

Tell me a little bit about your family and how you grew up.

My entire family lives in Singapore, and I lived there for 18 years before I came to the U.S. for school. I was always in local schools, not international — I pick up accents really quickly! My dad is an engineer and my mom is an auditor/accountant. My sister is six years younger and is special needs.

I grew up in Singapore, which is a very small country. I think it's half the size of New York, including the surrounding areas. It's a very tiny island, a dot on the map, just one city that's one country. Singapore's nickname is "little red dot" because we're literally a dot on the map. It's a very cosmopolitan, international city, so a lot of what we grew up to was very global. I watched a lot of American TV growing up, so I heard about high school, etc. There wasn't a huge culture shock.

Coming here, the biggest difference was people's values and how they respond in casual social situations. The accent was also a big thing when I came. I came speaking my Singlish (Singaporean accent), which in an ideal world you should be proud of, but it made me different. I was the "FOB".

When did you decide you wanted to go to school in America?

A lot of people in Singapore wanted to study abroad. I don't know when it became a thing to do, but people would go out of school, apply to educational scholarships from the government, and all have dreams of going abroad. I honestly kind of followed everyone, but I differentiated from everyone a little bit because most people applied for the UK, since it's closer and you do the A-levels in school, but I applied to the U.S. just to be a little farther away.

My friend told me that my personality has changed a little since then. I used to be very artsy and introverted. My friend told me then that if I went to the UK, I would love it (tea and scones and art and music! Plus, I'd have a cool British accent) but I wouldn't really change that much. I'd become even more what I already was, but coming to the U.S. has made me more balanced.

Who set those standards when you were young? Did you have a lot of pressure from your parents, friends, or was it something you always wanted to do?

Singaporean culture in general has a very fixed definition of success. If I stayed in Singapore, I probably wouldn't have studied social sciences, I would've studied law. At home, what's prestigious is medicine, law, maybe engineering, some sciences, but not social sciences. There are exceptions of course, but in general it's very difficult to be like, "I'm going to quit school and do music." People around you don't encourage it or value it as much. Here, I get a lot of, "Oh, you should pursue your dreams," or "It's cool that you're doing something so unique." There's also just a smaller audience for that stuff in Singapore. It's hard for people who don't end up following the ideal educational path. If you're on that path, you end up being very well educated, but if you're not, then it's harder for you to find your own version of success.

This sounds a lot like the experience of a lot of Asian Americans who grow up with their parents' pressure, sometimes even more so. My parents came in with a fixed idea of success, and while they pushed me to do arts to become well-rounded, they never wanted me to do it as a career.

I'm lucky, because although my parents have very different careers and interests, I was still able to pursue artsy stuff — social sciences, dance, and marketing. At home, you specialize a little earlier and pick which subjects you want to study. There was an all-science route and one with the arts. For a while, I did the all science route under pressure but switched into the humanities program when I was 17. It was a fairly late change, but I was lucky because after I made that switch, the humanities program was still very prestigious and I was able to swing it this way. For me, even though I was studying humanities, I could say it's a prestigious program and eventually I went to Penn, an Ivy League school. Even when I was so involved with dance, I could say, "Hey, I was the director" or that it helped my resume. Eventually, my parents realized that I was figuring it out anyway. I had success even though I was doing what I was interested in. I honestly think a lot of it is luck. Even where I am today, a lot of it was luck — I could've easily studied the arts and been unsuccessful. So, I don't think my parents completely understood what I wanted to do from the beginning, but I'm thankful that they still ended up being supportive.

When did you start getting so involved with the arts?

I don't remember clearly but I think I used to watch music videos and imitate them when I was young. When I was 13, I wanted to learn how to dance. I auditioned for gymnastics, Chinese dance, and modern dance, and somehow landed in a Chinese dance group. I invested a lot in that for four years, and my love for dance grew from there. I switched to modern dance and hip hop. I also started singing in junior college.

You must've known you could sing before. For people who can't sing (cough me cough) — trust me, you know pretty early on.

I went to karaoke when I was pretty young and my cousins would say, "Sing more, sing more!" but that was about it. I never sang publicly until one opportunity came up in school. We used to have assembly where the students would line up according to class and sing the national anthem and do morning announcements. I was helping out in a service project and we had the idea of singing the announcements for Valentine's Day. Somehow I ended up doing that, one thing led to another, and my school ended up doing a talent show I was encouraged to audition for. Anyone who is involved in performing arts has a secret dream of one day performing, so I just went after it. People started knowing that I could sing, and it kept going.

You mentioned that you're introverted, but for people who can't do performing arts, it's a big deal to be able to put yourself out there. Was that hard for you, or did you fully have the confidence for your talents?

Hmm, interesting! I never thought about this before. I don't know why this never came up. When I first started dancing, I was insecure. I remember a friend saying, "Oh Meiling, you want to dance? I can't imagine you in a leotard" and I was surprised. But I also have a little bit of a rebellious streak so I thought, "I am going to dance!" I concentrated more on practice, and then just went on stage. I built confidence over time. I never thought about it as an introversion issue — it's different from being shy. The introversion was good motivation, since I tend to be a little more reserved in some settings but in dancing and singing, you can be as emotional as you want.

Even though you want to hide your emotions in some contexts, in dance you can be as tough and angry as you want. You get to be the person you usually are not. This might also be why I'm so much more into hip hop than other classes. When I went to modern classes, they all told me to "get in touch with my soul" and it felt very therapeutic, but after a while, I felt like I was already naturally mellow and wanted dance to help me get out of that feeling.

Is that what you like most out of dance? What do you like out of the performing arts that you do?

To be totally candid — a lot of it is that I can be good at it. I knew that I could pick it up fast and keep growing and be good. That's definitely motivation. But the feeling of it also helps a LOT. In modern dance, I've cried on stage from emotion. I love the feeling of being in a theater when the lights are all out, right before the show's about to start. I remember watching a show recently and right before the show began, I remember feeling, "I know what this feels like." I don't know how to describe it. It feels like release. "I get to be this; I get to show people I can be something!" Adrenaline rush.

Since you did so many performing arts in school, do you think your college experience will end up being different from someone who hasn't?

I definitely relate to someone who's done performing arts in school. Whenever I meet other people who dance a lot, we think, "We went to school for dance." Yes, I'll do my other school work, but the reason why I wake up every day is because I have something else waiting for me and I have a show we're building towards. You can give yourself to it entirely. It shaped my work ethic.

Is this something special or unique to college?

I have some friends who have joined groups and are able to feel that way again. I feel the same kind of dedication, but I know I have less time and space for it. I can see how that same kind of passion can be translated to something else. If not dance, I have other things I'm passionate about too, so maybe it can be in those areas.

Could you ever make a career out of this?

There's a part of me that is really motivated and a little competitive, so I know I can get to a certain level if I train as hard as other people. But at the same time, I think, "So what if I get there?" I don't think I could be a professional dancer. I want other intellectual stimulation and have bigger impact somehow. The same maximizing attitude I have about wanting to be good at everything applies here. I want to have a good career, but also be able to say at one point in my life, I was so into dance.

Do you think many people have passions like you have for dance?

Yes, but my point of view is also biased because I'm around a lot of dancers. I definitely think that the people who started early or know they want to dance for a living are the ones who really go for it. The rest of us love it, but know we still want a stable job and other things in life. We're still passionate, but we won't be pushing as hard as people who knew they wanted to do this since they were 13, had their parents support them, and now they're dancing for Beyonce or something.

Will you encourage your children to do the same thing?

To dance, or be passionate? I enjoyed both so much that I couldn't let anyone not experience either. I also see life and your being able to be here as your chance to explore. Not to sound overly philosophical, but I want to see the depths of humanity. What are the peaks and troughs of emotion? How can you feel as a human being? What can you do as a human, what can you appreciate because you have 5 senses? That to me is a lot of what life is about — being able to appreciate and observe beauty and value and humanity. Having a passion is a very important part of that. With art and dance, you get to hit a peak of emotion that you couldn't get to otherwise. That feeling is like, "Man! This is life; this is what life is for!" People need to feel this way! If this is the max and min of life, people can't go down the middle.

Spoken like an artist. Do you think there was a point you started thinking of it this way?

I think it helped when I switched from sciences to humanities. My four main courses were geography (more like geology here), literature, econ, and math. The literature in addition to the performing arts helped me appreciate it. Literature is a lot about the meaning of a word and how it ties into other meetings. When writing a paper, it's about the details, so I've held onto those details, and it's come across in dance.

Have you met people that disagree or don't see dance the way that you do?

I think, but a good amount of them can recognize the same passion for something else. There are definitely people who say they don't get it, and I find it a little harder to connect with them. I don't need someone to completely relate to how I feel, but it'd be nice for them to understand where I'm coming from.

Do you see any barriers between yourself and other people who don't share your identities, like non-humanities folks, non-dancers, etc? That is, how strongly do you feel about your identity and how you relate to people who share and don't share your identity?

There are definitely differences, but the differences are all different for each of those groups. Ultimatley, yes, I have my own thing, but I don't really see them as any more important as anyone else's. I think everyone has their own perspective and cool thing that they're doing in life. It's interesting because there's a lot of talk in the US about their identity — "I am African American" or "I am Asian American", etc. I guess it's because I grew up in Singapore where racial harmony was emphasized. I never thought growing up, "I am Chinese and these are my boundaries."

That's interesting — in college, I did a lot of cultural activities and we noticed a lot of international students approached this topic a little differently. Do you think in Singapore, national identity was more important than racial identity? In America, there's always the question of, "Are you American?" or "How dare you say I'm not American?"

I don't want to speak for all Singaporeans, but I do think the national identity of Singapore is stronger. Things are also changing because more and more immigrants are coming, such as from China. When more of those people start moving, I think more distinctions will come up. When I was growing up, the national identity was much stronger — I never questioned that I was Singaporean, even though it was a melting pot country.

Were most of your cultural influences growing up Western or Eastern?

Chinese, definitely a little bit just because of family and background. The Western part was a little more self-imposed out of my own interest. I remember asking my mom, "Why are we speaking Chinese? We're English." Haha, so I was definitely like that when I was younger.

Was there a big transition moving here? I'd think there's a huge difference moving east to west.

When you're abroad, you do hear about it — "Americans are like this," or "Americans are more outspoken" — so there was some mental preparation. In terms of how I think about it, I think we've always done well, such as in work. I feel like if everyone is speaking up, I don't mind lying back and differentiating myself in different ways.

That's a good way to think about it — not everyone can be a super loud, Type A leader.

Right. There's some kind of pride in being different, too. Not everyone likes that kind of leader. When I'm forced into a position of leadership, I can do it, but I tend to be less loud about wanting to be in those positions. When I led my dance group Strictly Funk, I always lay low and did my thing, offered to take on smaller responsibilities, and eventually rose up. At work, it's hard to be any different than that.

What's something about you that not many people know?

A lot of people don't know this, but when I was younger, I was very interested in finding. purpose in life. I thought about religion a lot. (Haha, I was so young, too, I shouldn't have been thinking so much about this.) I was like the kid in Life of Pi. I didn't explore religions in hopes of converting, but I was always curious about what they meant and what their attitudes were. Not just religion, but philosophies in general. I grew up in a family that was a strange combination of Buddhism, Taoism, and Christianity. I never understood how different people could so vehemently believe in different things and still live together. I thought, "How do they all live together?"

Did you find a religion you agreed with?

No, I call myself agnostic. After looking so much, I think there's no way for me to know. I do think there's a higher order, but I have no way to see what it is. I don't think so much about fate, though that's not a yes or no in terms of believing in fate.

I think the Chinese concept of destiny ("yuan fen") is interesting — a lot of Western philosophy views time as linear, while Eastern philosophies view time as cyclical. I couldn't help but feel like I that I was repeating some sort of life process that was lived out before.

Wow. I think that's a really cool idea, up there with karma. When I was really young, around ten years old, I thought about this a lot.

I also thought about this a lot when I was ten!

Good! Good! The question is there, and I feel like it can't be ignored. When I don't have an answer, I feel like I don't have a purpose in life and it makes me very sad.

That's totally true. Religion is enough purpose for many people. Without it, you have to try very hard to find your own purpose.

Exactly. That's the thing about being agnostic. When I read Life of Pi, I remember a paragraph about how agnosticism was the worst because you weren't choosing anything. People who believe in a religion at least believe in something and they're moving forward.

I like agnosticism because I accept the possibility of everything. I think once you pick something, you're closing doors. I tend to do that with all things — that's what scares me about adulthood. I think it's scary for me because in childhood, we were encouraged to open all of these doors and now suddenly, we have to begin to close them. Even with your hobbies, you have to start closing doors.

That's true, but also as I grew up, I feel like every step opened more doors. Beyond the defined path of success, I would go down the path of deciding what school I'd go to, what careers I'd have, where I wanted to live, etc. Those all became new opportunities for me. These are question asked a lot from you in America. You can choose between different cities, states, and careers. I grew up thinking Singapore was my world. I knew I wanted to go overseas, but I always thought I was going to come back. But now, suddenly there is the sense that the world is sometimes an overwhelming place. But the same time, the world is your oyster. ■